Can we use a different battery in the iNew v3?

[noman1]

@yamontv, you're right, so better to use a 4.2 V battery (exampleL: Thl W8), not 4,35V ( ZTE V987) , because it will charge to 100% and not 88%

[Quad]

Battery came in my country. i think i will have it tomorrow or saturday, but this weekend i am not at home. ;)
I can confirm the statistics later.

[nikstar]

@yamontv and @noman1
Well, you should google and read about Li-ion cells cause what are you saying is not correct.

And keep on mind that the charging level is talking under control of the phone (at our case-phones) so ANY battery if you put, it will be charged to the SAME level.

[noman1]

@nikstar, I'm not going to argue , I'm not a specialist on this subject,
but why battery Samsung SDI ICR18650-30B can be charged to 4.35 V and the Samsung ICR18650-22P to 4.2 V?

Just asking, based on what is written on the web.

[nikstar]

Well this takes a lot of talking. Many brands now have produced batteries at maximum 4.35v. They have done some modifications to "stand" that extra voltage.
Below is a quote from some guy who made some tests:

Some words on the Samsung 30A by a CPF guy :
"Just an FYI, I tested Samsung 2800 and 3000 mAh cells over the past year. 2 of them I just tested new never used but were produced about 1 year ago.

Large increase in internal resistance, and big drop in capacity just from sitting for 1 year at like 40-50% SOC. These cells were never used. The ones I tested previously (when they were newer) has a nominal voltage of almost 3.8v @ .2C. (rated at 4.35) Now its a nominal voltage of about 3.6v, which means the resistance has increased a lot. Capacity of the 3000mAh cell is now about 2700-2800

So these batteries can hold a little a bit more power with less life cycle.

Also some batteries have protected circuit, some others not. The majority on china phone's does not have protected batteries which means if your phone charges up to 4,2v and if you put a 4,3 rated battery it should be the same because the phone will stop the charging at 4,2v.

[yamontv]

@yamontv and @noman1
Well, you should google and read about Li-ion cells cause what are you saying is not correct.

And keep on mind that the charging level is talking under control of the phone (at our case-phones) so ANY battery if you put, it will be charged to the SAME level.

I'm hardware design engineer by profession and I think I know a little about Li-Ion batteries and charging process.
There is charging voltage parametr in phones. This voltage is a top voltage that can be achieved by phone at the end of charging process when battery stop to get current (fully charged). And if you give less voltage to battery that constructed to get more voltage (to get extra capacity) eventually it will never fully charged.
So if we have 3.8 nominal voltage and charge it as it is 3.7, we loose capacity.
THL W8 constructed to 3.7V nominal voltage and it is not boosted for extra capacity as INew or ZTE battery. It has real 2000 mAh capacity (may be less), and other 3.8V batteries with also 2000 mAh has more less capacity, because they are boosted.
But ZTE battery is 2500 so it will be much better than THL.
Excuse me for my English, it is not my native language.

[nikstar]

No worries about your language, is not my native language too.
I am an electronic technician and I also know some things about batteries and I read a lot when the 4,35v batteries introduced a couple years ago by samsung, lg and I don't remember the other brand.
The nominal voltage it's just the average between the maximum and minimum limits. More or less it is just a number. So by increasing the maximum, you increase the nominal voltage.
The point is that the 4,2v have healthier lives than the 4,35. Probably this will be changed during years cause technology always developing very fast.
The chemistry is the same at both of these batteries by they manage to increase the voltage doing some "tricks".
In conclusion iNew's battery has a rate of 4,35 but our phone is charging it up to 4,2.
If you charge it (on a external charger) up to 4,35 you will get more power but you get less charging cycles.

[yamontv]

No worries about your language, is not my native language too.
I am an electronic technician and I also know some things about batteries and I read a lot when the 4,35v batteries introduced a couple years ago by samsung, lg and I don't remember the other brand.
The nominal voltage it's just the average between the maximum and minimum limits. More or less it is just a number. So by increasing the maximum, you increase the nominal voltage.
The point is that the 4,2v have healthier lives than the 4,35. Probably this will be changed during years cause technology always developing very fast.
The chemistry is the same at both of these batteries by they manage to increase the voltage doing some "tricks".
In conclusion iNew's battery has a rate of 4,35 but our phone is charging it up to 4,2.
If you charge it (on a external charger) up to 4,35 you will get more power but you get less charging cycles.

We are talking about the same things. Inew phone doesn't fully charge it's original battery because it's charging voltage is not appropriate (but I thought that it is fixed in 1.0.4 ROM). Otherwise if 2 batteries have the same rated capacity, battery with lower nominal voltage physicaly have more chemistry volume and capacity. Because additional capacity in bigger voltage batteries is boosted by increasing max charging voltage.
So if phone has charging voltage suited for 3.7V batteries it is better to use 3.7V batteries despite of the fact that 2 batteries may have the same capacity value.
But it's not mean that we can't use batteries with 3.8V nominal voltage in phones where nominal voltage is 3.7V. In this case battery will serve longer with a bit less capacity.
But if we have opposite sittuation (phone with 3.8V and battery with 3.7), it may cause fast battery degradation and even it's explosion In most batteries that I see inside there was only undervoltage protection and short circuit protection controller. So if you give more than 4.35V you will damage almost any battery. And if you give 4.35 to 4.2 battery you will damage it too but after several recharging cycles.

[nikstar]

We are talking about the same things.

Yes I know...

Inew phone doesn't fully charge it's original battery because it's charging voltage is not appropriate (but I thought that it is fixed in 1.0.4 ROM).

There are a few cases that iNew is charging the battery up to 4,35 and I do not know why

Both ways can work. Even in a 4,2 battery you can give a 0,15v. It is not tooo much. It will not explode (under normal circumstances) but eventually it will lose its capacity and its maximum charging level will be dropped.

In most batteries that I see inside there was only undervoltage protection and short circuit protection controller. So if you give more than 4.35V you will damage almost any battery.

There are batteries with overcharge protective circuit build in. Phone manufactures doesn't like this idea because they need that space for making the battery with bigger capacity. I can recall a Samsung phone (not remember the model) with build in the battery overcharge protective circuit.

And you can give more than 5-6v to charge the battery but you have to reduce the voltage as the battery charges.
Some chargers (not for phone's batteries) use about 40% more voltage at the beginning of the charging and then slowly gradually reduce the voltage (as battery's voltage increased)
My argument with you is that I personally don't trust the 4,35v batteries.
If you compare life cycles with the 4,2v all the odds goes to 4,2 ones.
On the other side you gaining more power, so everything is subjective.

[yamontv]

There are a few cases that iNew is charging the battery up to 4,35 and I do not know why

If it be possible to get kernel source... But it's only dream.

Both ways can work. Even in a 4,2 battery you can give a 0,15v. It is not tooo much. It will not explode (under normal circumstances) but eventually it will lose its capacity and its maximum charging level will be dropped.

It will not explode in normal, but there is such chance. And I don't want to have bomb in my pocket.

And you can give more than 5-6v to charge the battery but you have to reduce the voltage as the battery charges.
Some chargers (not for phone's batteries) use about 40% more voltage at the beginning of the charging and then slowly gradually reduce the voltage (as battery's voltage increased)

This only assume that it has current limitter in it, not an overvoltage protection. So if you don't reduce voltage, you overcharge and eventually damage battery.

My argument with you is that I personally don't trust the 4,35v batteries.
If you compare life cycles with the 4,2v all the odds goes to 4,2 ones.
On the other side you gaining more power, so everything is subjective.

Manufacturers guarantee that it work with this voltage N cycles so I trust them. And even if this N is a bit smaller than 4.2 batteries, nobody notice that.