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+--- Thread: [Innos D6000] a note regarding battery use (/Thread-Innos-D6000-a-note-regarding-battery-use)
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[Innos D6000] a note regarding battery use - MegaManX - 2015-11-10
In the first ROM version I had, Multilanguage Common v1.1 Android 5.0, the external battery discharged first, then the internal would start to be used when the external was at 1%. This subjects the internal battery to less recharge cycles and in my opinion (and according to Gizbeat opinion), this is the appropriate way it should be because we can't easily change the internal battery.
The new ROM, I'm not sure which ROM it started with actually, because I jumped right to v2.4, the external discharges to 49%, then the internal discharges to 49% and it starts to use external again (not sure at which point it switches back to internal again because haven't gotten that far yet).
Hope Innos will change this in a ROM update.
RE: [Innos D6000] a note regarding battery use - tommycc2244 - 2015-11-11
do we know if this is also true for version v2.5 ?
RE: [Innos D6000] a note regarding battery use - MegaManX - 2015-11-11
Yes, it's same on v2.5... Crappy. ROM seems good except for that.
RE: [Innos D6000] a note regarding battery use - tommycc2244 - 2015-11-12
Ok thanks!
they seem like good quality batteries, so im sure they should last at least 2 years, that's pretty good for us$250 price tag.
RE: [Innos D6000] a note regarding battery use - gbrlhtclcq - 2015-11-12
A battery does not like to be discharged to 5% or less for long duration, that's probably why they did this: before the external will go to less than 5%, and will stay there as long as the internal battery does not discharge, which can take a few days.
RE: [Innos D6000] a note regarding battery use - MegaManX - 2015-11-12
(2015-11-12, 20:46)gbrlhtclcq Wrote: A battery does not like to be discharged to 5% or less for long duration, that's probably why they did this: before the external will go to less than 5%, and will stay there as long as the internal battery does not discharge, which can take a few days.It's all about voltage, not %. Discharging it down to 3.6 or so is no problem. Lithium will stay for a week or two like that without issue. If you left it for many weeks like that, okay, then possibly you have a point.
Anyways, it's still discharging down to 2% then switching back to internal with external staying at 2% while the internal discharges from 49% down.
There really is no sense to that method. Unless there was some huge difference between internal from 100% to off and from 49% to off, but that's not the case.
Even if you disagree, the whole point here is that the external is easy to change. The internal not (can't even find it for sale anywhere)..... So really want to subject it to as few cycles as possible. What would be nice is if they gave us a choice in the ROM. A selector or some such in settings, because obviously there are differing opinions here.
RE: [Innos D6000] a note regarding battery use - tommycc2244 - 2015-11-12
(2015-11-12, 20:46)gbrlhtclcq Wrote: A battery does not like to be discharged to 5% or less for long duration, that's probably why they did this: before the external will go to less than 5%, and will stay there as long as the internal battery does not discharge, which can take a few days.
these are Smartphones, they have voltage detectors in them... when your phone says ur battery has 5% left, it doesn't mean it has 5% of actual charge left, it just means that the voltage of the battery is getting close to the safest lowest voltage set by the phone maker. the phone itself should force shutdown if it detects the battery is past the predefined safe voltage thus you can only damage the battery by taking it out and hard wiring a led light to it and further draining the voltage down past 2v or so... a cheap 18650 led torch on the other hand, doesn't have low voltage protection, it will just drain the battery until the led light cannot light up anymore and leaving the battery under 2 volts and damaged.
the problem with this phone is how many times you charge and recharge, i think the cycle life should be 500 or so times, or 1.5 years if charged every night... not sure but I must say the batteries in the d6000 are very long lasting.
(2015-11-12, 22:48)MegaManX Wrote:(2015-11-12, 20:46)gbrlhtclcq Wrote: A battery does not like to be discharged to 5% or less for long duration, that's probably why they did this: before the external will go to less than 5%, and will stay there as long as the internal battery does not discharge, which can take a few days.It's all about voltage, not %. Discharging it down to 3.6 or so is no problem. Lithium will stay for a week or two like that without issue. If you left it for many weeks like that, okay, then possibly you have a point.
Anyways, it's still discharging down to 2% then switching back to internal with external staying at 2% while the internal discharges from 49% down.
There really is no sense to that method. Unless there was some huge difference between internal from 100% to off and from 49% to off, but that's not the case.
Even if you disagree, the whole point here is that the external is easy to change. The internal not (can't even find it for sale anywhere)..... So really want to subject it to as few cycles as possible. What would be nice is if they gave us a choice in the ROM. A selector or some such in settings, because obviously there are differing opinions here.
as a user I agree with you totally, wear out the parts I can replace easiest first... but i think Innos are trying to wear out both batteries at the same time which might mean less users experiencing the external battery dieing very quickly and the internal lasting longer... with how v2.5 battery profile is, both batteries will degarde together and the user hopefully not seeing a big difference between the 2 batteries life span.
RE: [Innos D6000] a note regarding battery use - ptrs2001 - 2015-11-17
Lithium ion batteries are happiest between 50-80%. Storing a lithium-ion device, like e.g. a Macbook, with full battery also degrades battery life, i.e. it is better to drain to 50-80 % before storing. So thereby it's not good to always have the internal battery always on 100%. So if you think about it, basically the new setup should actually ensure longer a longer lifetime for both batteries, as long as on average you charge the phone before it starts draining the external battery below 49%, which is what you probably do anyway already: Usually I charge it every other day, which is exactly the point where the external reaches around 50%. The rest of the power I use on trips etc
RE: [Innos D6000] a note regarding battery use - cookiedough - 2015-11-17
(2015-11-17, 18:56)ptrs2001 Wrote: Lithium ion batteries are happiest between 50-80%. Storing a lithium-ion device, like e.g. a Macbook, with full battery also degrades battery life, i.e. it is better to drain to 50-80 % before storing. So thereby it's not good to always have the internal battery always on 100%. So if you think about it, basically the new setup should actually ensure longer a longer lifetime for both batteries, as long as on average you charge the phone before it starts draining the external battery below 49%, which is what you probably do anyway already: Usually I charge it every other day, which is exactly the point where the external reaches around 50%. The rest of the power I use on trips etcIt's not like the battery is going away into storage for many months... It will still be used when needed. Regardless, putting a battery through more cycles is going to "hurt" a battery far more than keeping it at 100%.
Especially in your described charging scenario... In your case, if the external was discharged first down to a reasonable amount (3.6V or so), you could leave the internal nearly fresh "forever" being that you're currently using 50% of the combined batteries juice before putting it on the charger.
If one were to almost always use the entire 2 batteries before charging, its not going to matter either way.
But as you said, and I think this is the way most people do it... They'll throw it on the charger long before dead most of the time. Yes, the external will receive far more wear. But being that owners can't even get the internal yet and it's easy to change the external...
What would be awesome is if they gave users a choice of profiles.
RE: [Innos D6000] a note regarding battery use - ptrs2001 - 2015-11-17
You are correct, cookiedough, that load cycles decrease the capacity over time. However most Li-ion batteries are designed for 500 load cycles. At that stage significant (II believe 20% but don't quote me on the number) decrease in capacity is expected, but the battery should remain working just fine. Moreover, if you want to ensure using as few load cycles as possible, you should plug in the phone as often as possible: as long as the phone is on the mainz, it is not using battery, therefore not using load cycles. So if you really want to "spare" the battery it makes sense to charge the phone every night. This will already make sure you are not using load cycles for a third of every day. This would however mean that the internal battery is never discharged and effectively is in storage for long periods. And as you know as well, storing full batteries IS detrimental for battery capacity, while going through 500 load cycles on the internal battery (if you miraculously know how to completely empty it every day) and charge it for 1/3 of the day will take you 500/2*3=750 days, or about two years. In other words: Stop worrying about the exact algorithm used for charging the batteries: You will have long grown tired of this phone before the batteries wear out!